EDL & UAF Demo & Counter Demo In Stoke-on-Trent Part 2: During

Somehow,I don't think they where round by Waterstones to get the new best seller, or round by Wilkos for the cheepo disinfectant, or in BHS for a few sets of them very comfie pants they have, or even just nipping in Argos after the new caterlog. No, no, no, this lot where out for one thing and one thing only,and it was'nt a MacDs Happy Meal, it was a bloody good ruck.

Could it be the fact that some genious decided to keep the EDL supporters in the pub for four hours.
From 11 till 3 they were kept in the pub area, instead of being allowed to march and get it over with.
Great tactic, so that it started at the same time as the meeting outside the town hall, less than 30 yards from each other, outstanding.
Common sense was in short supply yesterday,on both sides, the EDL,and the Police.

Terry, no one MADE them go to the Pub, no one MADE them buy beer, no one MADE them have more than one beer. We were at the police briefings and they were extremely organised, and prepared. The sheer numbers of protesters and the fact that a lot of locals got intermingled with them was what made things a bit tricky. I'd have cordoned off the general public but it's easy to speak with hindsight.

The Real EDL guys who we met at Keele services, seemed like decent enough blokes, genuine approach to the EDL mission. The same couldn't be said for a lot of the people who were in Hanley.

Personally, I just think it's sad that Stoke taxpayers have to foot the bill.

Forced to the pub and made to drink beer, the poor buggers, I meen its shocking, must be against there human rights. Tell you what, if they tell us more in advance the next time they are comeing, we'll get a bloody fun fair to set up in The Tontine, get them doing free bumper car rides.
Terry, with repect mate, what did they expect the bobbies to do, just let them walk around, giveing the lip, with women and kids trying to shop. No, you bet your life, they came hear knowing full well what would happen, they would be ketteled. Last year when it kicked off at the G20, you where one of the first to comdem the actions of the left wind unwashed reacting in much the same way the EDL reacted in Hanley, only this time it was the right wing braindead........and unwashed.

Warren, Tideswellman, I was just pointing out the facts.
One the march was delayed.
Two, it gave them more time to drink, 3 hours more.
You don't have to be a genious to know the outcome of that tactic.
This will be my last comment on this site as Rawlins wants me off.
Ive just got to reply to his post first.

The march wasn't delayed. The police planning always had it starting at 3pm opposite Argos. The EDL publicised Wetherspoons as their meeting point.

1) Firstly there was never a MARCH. There was a family on the street asking the same thing. Saying"Why didn't they allow them to March?" The thing is, the EDL didn't apply to march, it was a static Protest. They weren't prevented from Marching. The speakers were planned, and had a stage on Old Hall st. The demo was planned to start at three.

Its interesting that there are always so many rumours flying around about events like this. It's time to put them to bed.

I believe that people should have a right to rally and raise their concerns, thats democracy.

Not sure what to make of the EDL. From looking at footage, you could have been watching a football match, where the police are having to keep a set of misbehaving football hooligans under control. I would like to think that the rally was as they state to make their point on extreme groups only, and everyone will make their own opinions on it. Clearly from the interview with one chap his issue was groups like Islam4Uk, which many would say was fair comment. Then you had those that were there just in case trouble erupted and they could get involved. Then you have those that hold extreme views on anyone non white.

The UAF seemed to have acted in an appropriate manner. Non confrontational was their aim.

I am interested in the comments the chap makes on Sharia Law. He tells us that Sharia Law is Sharia Law, and he knows of only one law. He takes issue with Sharia Courts being in this country yet when questioned further he can't really put up a good argument so he walks off. He tells us that it is a brutal law and just as it is in the middle east it is happening here in the UK. I'd love to know where? I thought the Sharia Courts dealt with such things as divorce? Would a criminal offence be dealt with in a Sharia Court, I think not.

The police clearly did a good job in keeping everything under control.

The losers in all of this was the shops, Saturday is a busy day for them, what a shame they had to close.

Nita, thats the point, some muslims just want to run there privet and famley lives by the laws layed down within there belifes, such as devorce, witch any normal thinking person could not realy find a problem with.

Whilst I think the blokes description of Sharia Law wasn't very good, I personally don't want to see Sharia law as being the law. He perhaps wasn't as media savvy as he could have been, he was at least one of the few EDL supporters who were prepared to talk to us at all.

I cant comment on Sharia too much because I'm not too aware of its exact implementation here in the UK but, I thing that EVERYONE should abide by the SAME law English Common Law.

Tideswellman. I totally agree, everyone should abide by the same law. Have a read of the following link taken from BBC web on Sharia Law. I didnt really know that much about it so thought I'd have a look, interesting reading.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7234870.stm

From what I make of it, these courts are not like courts as we know. They seem to be used for family business matters, divorce and to seek advice to ensure they are living their lives according to their faith. It doesn't override our laws, so do I have a problem with that, no. Some people may take issue, that is upto them. Religion is religion, people should follow what they wish to.

I would still love to know where in our country such things as beheading and cutting fingers off for stealing, as in middle east, goes on in our country? Instead of standing there accusing, maybe the EDL should give information to the police, as I'm sure such brutal acts would be dealt with in our courts.

I feel that you are being disingenuous to that EDL fella. I got the idea that he was simply trying to express his view that everyone living in England should be expected to live their lives under English law.

I have no problem with that …do you?

it seems that sharia law is not law in this country , but an arbitration service. Where is the problem. its similar to a catholic couple seeking advice and guidance from their priest, they just dont use the word law.

Lotto, I have no problem with that bloke from Liverpool expressing his views, all be it a bit nervisly. But just notice the way of when Wol gets the better of him in his knollage of the subject, he ducks out.
Cut mate,cut what...lol, and would it be leagel under Sharia Law.

The chap from the EDL was obviously not media-savvy, and I respect his right to air his views. However, he seems confused not only by Sharia Law, but by English Law also.

There are examples where a community or culture will not abide by English law in certain contexts (like family law) e.g. the right to remarry after divorce is a completely different kettle of fish for practicising Catholics than it is in English family law.

On Sharia he states that it is "the enemies' law" citing the Taliban and Iraq. Firstly, Iraq isn't our enemy, it is an ally, although I could excuse that slip-up and accept that he meant Iraqi insurgents. However, he fails to point out that some of the most "brutal" punishments are practiced in Saudi Arabia - our ally.

The rationality of the EDLs argument that Britain could 'adopt' Sharia law (like non-Muslim countries such as India, and wait for it...Israel) rests on three angles:

- Clarity on whether the EDL objects to 'Sharia law' being made THE law for all of us (as they infer by the word 'Islamification'), or any aspect of it (e.g. divorce law).

- If it is the latter then EDL would either have to provide justification for an inherent bias, given that Catholics can practice their own religious laws, i.e. 'Vatican law' in a divorce law context, but Muslims cannot. Or, to appear consistent, EDL would have to openly object to the 'contraventions' of English law by Catholics.

- If it is the former, then whilst I would also be against this whole-heartedly, the likelihood is remote and therefore clearly overblown for political ends. For Sharia law to stand any chance of becoming a major contention in future you would have to see a dramatic ursurge of pro-Sharia Muslims in the UK. Given that the current UK Muslim population is around 3%, and within that you have people who are lapsed, as well as Turks, Albanians, and Muslims from other 'non-Sharia' countries.

On an entirely less serious note, I wonder if any EDL supporters saw anything symbolic in Stoke beating a team from the Emirates?

Hello Tideswellman,

In case you don't already know, the deranged Nazi nutters who run Redwatch have swiped a couple of your photos of the anti-EDL demonstrators on the 23rd, and added them to their collection of "Stoke Reds".

Lack of respect for copyright is one of their milder unappealing habits.

Plane Jane, I have had loads of my photographs stolen and posted there :(

If you have a look around you can see some real horrors where they have done really bad edit jobs to remove copyright notices..

Hi all,

I've not posted on here before but I thought I'd just give my two-pence worth here. But before I start let me make it quite clear that I am in NO WAY racist or bigoted. I say the facts as I see them and I tell the truth, no more. Thank you.

Firstly -
I think we would all agree that no matter how hard a pro-nationalism organisation tries, they will always be open to hi-jack by extremists and plain old hooligans. I think that for this reason alone, the police should have had more about them than to allow both demonstrations on the same day in the same county, let alone within metres of each other. I mean really, how daft.

Secondly -
If like me you have lived in an area where there are a significant number of Sharia Law practising people you will have seen for yourself how their 'cultural customs' regarding law and behaviour affect the local area. For example: I see young girls getting into relationships with such people and finding themselves stuck with mentally, verbally and often physically abusive males who are only that way because of the cultural laws they abide by. I find it absolutely abhorrent that such abuse is allowed to flourish unchallenged by the law here in the UK. Sharia Law is in my honest opinion nothing more than a sophisticated type a gang culture which routinely suppresses the rights of women and (in this country at least) is very divisive by nature. To make my point more accessible to those who might disagree allow me to pose this question - "Why was it that we, the people of this country decided to move power of law away from the Church and into the house of parliament?" Really, go find out the answer and you'll find another reason for preventing the rise of popular belief when in concerns the liberties of the people.

Thirdly -
How often have we all seen alchohol turn normally law abiding and good peopleinto raging lunatics - many times I'd say. The fact that the police even allowed Weatherpoons to open its doors to this type of demo is simply staggering. As someone else pointed out, a bit of common sense would have gone a long, long way.

Finally -
The EDL has taken many opportunities to point out that they are NOT a racist organisation. And let's be fair they're shouting "Blacks Out - White Rule" are they? No, they're asking the State to maintain English Law and English Law in their own country. I stand firmly with anyone who wants to see a proud English nation of all colours and religions coming together under English Law. For pity's sake people stop believing what the media tells you and see the facts for what they are. It seems like people are looking but they're failing to understand what is infront of them.

*end of rant :p

Well put guest someone with plain common sense at last, but watch out guest you will be accused by all the nutters on this site of racism or some such crap.

Don't think so, partypooper, this one seems a bit more switched on then you mate, guest, we welcome your views, feel free to comment.

Partypooper Warren and I are often accused of being Lefties on this site. I'm personally not a leftie at all. I stand with what you said but has to be done in the correct manner.

Thats all. It will take a bit of factual knowledge and targeted protest to get these concerns out in the open.

Losing the rioters is essential for a successful organisation.

not letting people protest is not an option...Freedom of speech means that people can demonstrate if they want to and then people can counter protest. Its one of the important things in democracy ....if thats what you want to save..then we have to expect every individual to take personal responsibility for their actions.

Men who behave like children, irrespective of their political persuasion get no respect.
It's as simple as that.